Limyaael ([info]limyaael) wrote,
@ 2005-09-04 16:07:00
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Current mood: bouncy
Entry tags:fantasy rants: summer 2005, world-building: magic

Rant on elemental magic
For [info]cinnamonical, the first of two rants she asked for after she donated. I make fun of this system of magic a lot, so let’s see what I can make of it beyond that.



1) When adding new elements, beware of tweeness. This is actually the number one reason that I look at elemental magic cross-eyed: many authors go beyond the common circle of fire, air, earth, and water, and they do it in cutesy, schmoozy, weird ways.

The addition to the elemental circle is almost never a physical part of the world, the way the other four elements are. Instead, it’s “Spirit” or “Heart” or “Dream.” This is supposed to account for the “spiritual” or “mental” part of the world.

-Come on. Come up with something that doesn’t stink of crystals and incense.
-Why can’t the physical elements have mental and spiritual counterparts? What would emotional fire be like? Maybe twee, too, but at least it’d be a change of pace from “Spirit” mages, who tend to wander around with twee wise looks on their faces and give twee psychobabble lectures.
-It would be possible to come up with a different circle of elements based on other parts of the world. Fire, earth, water, and air are common, but there’s no reason that someone needs to invent that system in another world. Perhaps your own imaginary culture is very heaven-oriented, and chooses as the elements sun, stars, moons, and cloud. Perhaps the sky, earth, and sea are considered elements, and nothing else is, because nothing else is a place that humans can travel through. Perhaps snow and ice are important to northern cultures, but not to southern ones.

If you’re trying for a serious tone, the twee addition to elemental magic ruins it, especially when it has nothing in common with the other elements. Restrain yourself.

2) Relate the elements one to another. The only elemental “relationship” I’ve seen explored in any depth in most fantasy is the opposition of fire and water. Fire mages can’t sail on ships without getting sick, or water mages burn more easily, or fire and water mages have always been deadly enemies. The rare attempts to bring in air and earth don’t amount to much. (Matter of fact, earth magic is just rare, period. Those hero/ines who have earth magic almost always have something else as well, or the author concentrates not on the rock and stone and soil, but the person’s connection to animals and plants. This can be a problem. See point 4).

For example, there are places where the elements might blend, or share their dominion. Is a volcano in the domain of earth or the domain of fire? Is lightning fire? Most authors say yes because it can start fires, but on the other hand, pure lightning is electric force, and it moves through the air and strikes the ground. What about mist, fog, snow, and other forms of water that need the addition of air and cold to make them active? Is light always going to be in a fire mage’s province to create, even if it’s only a reflection from a different source, the way that moonlight is? Elemental mages would have a reason to know some science that other people in the world might not, so they could know that the equation isn’t as simple as moonlight= light= fire. And if you start blending the elements, and then including other elements in the circle, you get a new bunch of them that need to be defined and explored.

Same with the way that humans conceive their relationships to each other, really.

3) What is the mythology/religion/customs/traditions/laws of this society as they pertain to elemental magic? Many fantasy worlds develop to an amazing level of sophistication in technology and other parts of their cultures without developing a complex religion or mythology. It’s puzzling. Once people have some leisure to sit back and think—whether it’s only a tiny part of the society, such as a privileged class, or whether everyone in it, thanks to magic, manages to do something other than search for food and defend themselves against enemies all day long—they often start meditating on the world around them, and producing explanations for it. Then other people argue the explanations, and provide alternative explanations, and schools of thought and philosophy and religion, and maybe heresy too, are born. It doesn’t require widespread literary, either, just people willing to talk and people willing to listen. There were dozens of small and flourishing Christian heresies before the Church stamped them out. People can get passionate about beliefs that don’t have to do with twenty-first-century moral concerns. In a world where the existence of elemental magic is true beyond a doubt, then the people around the elemental mages will talk and debate and discuss and build edifices of thought incorporating or centering on it. It’s a fact, and so it will get used to prove things and disprove things and support things and tear things down.

It shouldn’t sit all by itself in isolation. Nor should the only customs concerning it be absolutely childishly simple—for example, that you don’t bother fire mages. Not everyone will be prone to heed the warnings, and if something dire happens because someone violates the barrier, then the stories that spring up to explain it won’t all be the same, either.

Address this in your society, please. The part of a fantasy world that often most needs crafting is the worldview. An author can know everything about the way her people behave and talk and dress and go to dinner parties, and still have huge gaps in her plotting if she ignores the way they think and conceive of the world around them. In fact, I believe that’s a major reason so many twenty-first-century morals are stuffed into the gaps; the author has nothing else to plug them with.

4) (You knew this was coming, didn’t you?) Limit them! Elemental mages are some of the most powerful in fantasy. A fire mage who does get her author’s go-ahead to command magma and lightning as well as fire is no joke. Neither is a water mage who can call on the sea, or an air mage who can deprive you of oxygen, or an earth mage who causes a mudslide or earthquake. (Poor ignored earth mages).

And then a lot of authors will go and make their protagonists into the kind of people who command two elements even though everyone else only commands one, or all four when everyone else commands just two, or the most powerful mage of her kind EVAR, compared to whom everyone else is weak and puny. So then the fire mage commands the sea, too, and the wind, and the earth (as if she cared). And then there are people hurling cataclysms around, and hefting catastrophes, and helping along cacophonies of force, and I’m hurling up breakfast.

You should know what elemental mages can and can’t do. Yes, include the “can’t” as well as the “can.” Once you have established absolute rules, don’t break them. No, not even for your protagonist. Force your mages to work within the limits rather than suddenly sprouting new talents or levels of strength, which is also common.

And, for heaven’s sakes, don’t claim everything that could be vaguely under the umbrella of that element as a power for your mage. As I noted above, this is most common with earth magic. “Earth mages” are most often those people who can speak to animals and make the trees obey them, maybe march into battle. Yet, um, why? Trees are nourished by sunlight and air and water, too. Animals fly through the air and swim in the sea as well as walk on land, and they need to breathe. If anything, it seems that plants and animals would be gray areas where the elements blended, or not under the control of any single element at all. In the rush to categorize, you risk making your mages too powerful, and your world incomprehensible.

5) Know how they work with governments and the magic-less. Once again, most authors hew to extremes. The elemental mages are a tiny group who only seem to use their magic to defend themselves and in the final war with the Dark Lord, or they rule and use their magic to—well, benefit themselves, I suppose. (The ruling mages often do surprisingly little magic).

Yet there’re lots and lots of places for people who can work with the physical forces of the world. Wind and water mages would be in demand not only on ships, where some authors do put them, but to give crops good weather, provide pleasant days for large festivals, turn aside or dissipate storms, purify drinking water, move streams around or dam them, clear away this blasted fog, put this blasted fog in place so that it can blind the enemy or keep rival ships from sailing, calm this stream from flooding, coax that stream into flooding so that it can provide rich soil, make this hydraulic system work… There’s lots and lots of uses. Earth mages could restore soil, make it richer, help crops grow faster, call animals in for slaughter, prevent earthquakes and mudslides or clean up after them, insure that transported plants survive and acclimate to new soil, and do other things depending on what power you’ve given them. Ironically, though fire mages are the single most common kind across books, they would seem to have the least use in day-to-day life. Stop wildfires or lightning fires, control the natural flames that need to burn to clear out forests, light candles and lamps, help people start fires for cooking food or warmth, tend the forges, and after that I’m already running out of ideas. Other uses would be mostly destructive, and thus limited.

The next time that you’re looking for things for elemental mages to do, or thinking about what kind of daily life they’d have when they weren’t participating in battles, think about this. The mages themselves shouldn’t be isolated, any more than their magic should be in people’s minds. Intertwine them with the basic fabric of the world. Let them have lives to get disrupted, rather than ones they can drop at a moment’s notice to train the protagonist or accompany her on a quest.

6) Don’t ally all natural inclinations to talent. Not all fire mages need to be quick-tempered. (Also, not all of them need to have red hair. Can we please stop that?) Their magic is part of them, but it’s only the prime part of their life if an author makes it that way. Think about the talents you have, and the many, many desires, thoughts, wishes, irritations, ambitions, and tasks you have that your talent doesn’t impact on. The obsessive writer—hi—still has to eat and drink and rest and go to school or work, and she still wants ice cream and fresh fruit and new books and other things that she can write without. Real people don’t begin and end their lives in a sphere where nothing else but one facet of their personality exists, at least not without enormous outside coercion.

So you could have an elemental mage who doesn’t consider her magic to be a prime part of her life, or doesn’t spend all her time fretting that she’s not more powerful, or walks across the room and gets a bucket of water instead of conjuring one, because that’s simpler. You can have weak mages who are not jealous of the strong one, because they live in an environment where more things than mere strength at magic are valued, or they personally value something else. You can have strong mages who still don’t want to use their magic because they just aren’t interested, thanks, rather than because something dark in their past made them horribly afraid of themselves.

Perhaps because it is so common and so powerful, authors writing elemental mages seem to fall into this trap much more often than authors who work with other systems of magic. Please. Remember that your people have bodies and minds and tempers and inclinations of their own, too.

7) This can lead to more nature-oriented stories. If you have elemental mages working with the natural world, and knowing more about it than the average man on the village street, they can become passionately fond of it for its own sake. I think this would be neat, because the average presence of nature in fantasy gets reduced to helpful or hostile animals—of which my favorite are the Randomly Attacking Wolves that show up in the woods, spring at the hero, and then run away—quickly described landscape that does not actually affect the protagonist in any emotional way, and the occasional starry-eyed, “Animals are good, don’t eat them!” pseudo-Wiccan girl, or wise witch who works with non-specific “herbs.” Weather, especially cold, can be escaped by walking into an inn, disease is non-present, and the most commonly described sights and sounds are human. (Smell and taste, like earth magic, are shamefully neglected). Wounds and stains, authors’ last-ditch attempts at connecting heroes to reality, often vanish between one page and the next. This is a good reflection of the authors’ urbanized lives. It is bad for convincing people that this is a living fantasy world, especially a low-tech one.

So consider what might happen to an elemental mage who does not consider herself separated from nature, the way that so many people do; who doesn’t care about clothes as much as she does about trees; who thinks not only of the humans who are threatened if a Dark Lord rises, or the sentient other races like elves and dragons, but also the deer, the fish, and the insects; who thinks before she hurls around the awesome power that she can wield, about how long the land will take to recover from the impact of fire or flood, quake or tornado.



And next is handling a large cast of viewpoint characters, also for [info]cinnamonical.




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[info]londonkds
2005-09-04 08:18 pm UTC (link)
The addition to the elemental circle is almost never a physical part of the world, the way the other four elements are. Instead, it’s “Spirit” or “Heart” or “Dream.” This is supposed to account for the “spiritual” or “mental” part of the world.

OK, this person obviously has no clue about actual medieval beliefs on the four elements. Don't they know where "phlegmatic", "choleric", "melancholic" and "sanguine" come from?

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(no subject) - [info]kutsuwamushi, 2005-09-04 08:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]alex_von_cercek, 2005-09-04 08:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snapes_angel, 2005-09-04 09:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]londonkds, 2005-09-05 06:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]edg, 2005-09-04 09:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]silverwerecat, 2005-09-05 05:27 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]edg, 2005-09-05 05:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]silverwerecat, 2005-09-05 05:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kawakiisakazuki, 2005-09-05 07:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]elfbiter, 2005-09-05 01:38 pm UTC

[info]kutsuwamushi
2005-09-04 08:20 pm UTC (link)
I always thought it was a little odd when people writing about elemental magic included fire and only fire in addition to earth, air, and water. One of these things does not belong, one of these things is not like the others...

It makes sense in systems that are supposed to reflect certain Earth ideas about the elements, but it's done so much elsewhere that I wonder where these peoples' imaginations went.

I'm still waiting for a story to pop into my head that will allow me to use an original system of elemental magic.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ataniell93, 2005-09-05 12:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kutsuwamushi, 2005-09-05 01:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ankewehner, 2005-09-05 06:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jerrylovesmona, 2006-02-08 10:08 pm UTC

[info]ignipes
2005-09-04 08:24 pm UTC (link)
Great list, and one that strikes particularly close to home for me. (Erm. Yes, that was a lightning metaphor.) I'm a geologist, so I think about how the natural world and its elements work all the time. I don't expect all fantasy writers to adore rocks and mountains and climate as I do, but at the very least they can make an attempt to pay attention and get the details right.

There is no better way to get me to stop reading a story with elemental magic than to reduce it to a few simple, trite "powers" that don't make sense. (Same goes for characters who go on quests through vast wildernesses -- when it's painfully obvious that the author's wilderness experience consists of a jog around Central Park twice a week, but that's another problem entirely...)

I love the way it's handled in the Earthsea books, even though it's never called elemental magic. The principles are the same. Magic used for sailing, mining, farming, healing cows, fixing pots, stopping earthquakes, etc. -- it doesn't have to be all about blasting the bad guys with fireballs.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]laraqua, 2006-02-20 07:41 am UTC

[info]derryderrydown
2005-09-04 08:31 pm UTC (link)
I confess, I have used a 'fifth' element.

Then again, it was bloody-mindedness, so I don't think it was too twee.

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(no subject) - [info]donnaidh_sidhe, 2005-09-04 08:57 pm UTC

[info]dots
2005-09-04 08:33 pm UTC (link)
Wow. This is a really nice rant, there's a lot of points that I can apply to a magic system I'm developing for one world.

It really has started to irritate me when people isolate magic from the world, even moreso when magic is commonplace. With the elemental systems that get tossed around with magic, people rarely connect them to religion or mythology and it makes me upset. Because really, in say the traditional Fire/Eath/Water/Air system, the beliefs of those being the four basic elements were strongly tied back into mythology and culture.

I also dislike how people hardly ever address the reaction that might occur when magics are mixed. (And can I mention that seasick fire mages is possibly one of my biggest pet peeves ever?) I'm working on a system myself, which, while it has the basic Fire/Earth/Water/Air, also contains the ideals of Heat, Cold, and Void/Nothingness. Where Fire and Air and HEat mix, you get lightning. Where Air and Water mix, you get rain. So forth and so on. The thing about it is that I genuinely enjoy coming up with how things blend, and then I can relate the blending back to the worldview, because since magic is commonplace in this world, how its elements react majorly impacts people's worldviews.

I think there's really a lot of potential in the idea of elemental systems, but that a lot of times those ideas are just ignored in favor of the simple categorizations that most fantasy commonly takes. (I never understood animals=earth either, though I'm guilty of the plant one. But It just seemed to me if we don't categorize humans, why categorize animals?)

And I despise the mind/heart/spirit/soul element. With a passion.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:47 am UTC

[info]gamera
2005-09-04 08:35 pm UTC (link)
THANK YOU.

It really annoys me to see these stereotypes done so much, because in the fantasy world I write in the main system of magic in one of the countries is elemental magic. Of course, in that world elements aren't the standard water/fire/earth/wind, they're matter/positive energy/negative energy, and the various "traditional element" effects are built using those (fire would be pure positive energy, ice would be matter and negative energy, etc.). The whole "I use fire because it's in my personality/genes/destiny!" thing seems like a crutch to get past common sense. In the world I write in, people who live near rivers study combinations that will let them deal with water, because it would be the most beneficial to them. No great and powerful destiny here- they just don't want their houses destroyed in floods or their kids to fall in the river and drown.

I think geography is actually an extremely ignored factor in elemental magic systems as a whole, and it's a shame. There's so much potential there besides the "fire mages don't like large bodies of water" you mentioned above.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]gamera, 2005-09-05 03:26 am UTC

[info]merditha
2005-09-04 08:48 pm UTC (link)
I hope to get to that at some point, actually - in practical terms, a quick and passionate temper is far more likely in an air-mage or (shock of shocks) an earth-mage than it is in a fire-mage, within my system. Mostly because fire-mages - those that survive - have to have had such absolutely rigid control, lest they ignite everyone that pisses them off . . . instead, fire-mages tend to be known for their absolute, utter pig-headed obstinateness, because that rigid control tends to go with an insane amount of will-power, and will-power like that doesn't tend to take "no" or "go around, dammit" for an answer very well.

Which amused me when I discovered it, because stubbornness tend to be aligned with the earthmages. It's Meri's pigheadedness that tends to be blamed on her alignment, or assumed by her alignment, not her temper - that tends to startle and rather frighten anyone who knows anything about elemental magic. The only other living firemage is actually a rather placid young man.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]goldjadeocean, 2005-09-06 04:21 am UTC

[info]inarticulate
2005-09-04 08:55 pm UTC (link)
I really like five-elemental systems, like the Chinese one, so for your first point-- oh hell yes.. Every time I see Spirit or Heart, I think the author really liked Captain Planet far too much, and I can't take the book itself seriously. Thank you for this. It's really not that hard to avoid Spirit/Heart; I don't know why so many people seem to have trouble with it.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ankewehner, 2005-09-05 07:03 am UTC

[info]jenlittlebottom
2005-09-04 08:57 pm UTC (link)
The Chinese system uses Wood, Fire, Earth, Metal, and Water, which I always found interesting.

Now I want to write Elemental magic using chemical elements. Do Hydrogen Mages have an unfortunate tendency to float up to the ceiling if they don't concentrate? Do Sodium Mages have to keep the hell away from water? *grins*

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(no subject) - [info]alex_von_cercek, 2005-09-04 08:59 pm UTC
*cackles* - [info]jenlittlebottom, 2005-09-04 10:57 pm UTC
Re: *cackles* - [info]elanor_two, 2005-09-04 11:33 pm UTC
Re: *cackles* - [info]ariescelestial, 2005-09-04 11:47 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shati, 2005-09-04 09:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snapes_angel, 2005-09-04 09:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]l_clausewitz, 2005-09-05 12:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]secant, 2005-09-05 01:16 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]peacockharpy, 2005-09-07 06:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]otakukeith, 2005-09-05 03:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rhjunior, 2005-09-05 11:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jenlittlebottom, 2005-09-06 12:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jerrylovesmona, 2006-02-08 10:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]apolloniaf, 2008-07-24 03:45 am UTC

[info]shati
2005-09-04 09:04 pm UTC (link)
In chemistry class I did toy with the idea of an elemental system of magic wherein mages would wield the magical powers of helium, hydrogen, calcium, arsenic, gold, etc.

Unfortunately, I hate chemistry, so it didn't get very far.

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[info]tamerterra
2005-09-04 09:06 pm UTC (link)
Thank you!

I have an elemental system based on Earth/Fire/Water/Wind - and the Wind one can deprive people of oxygen. However, the type of spell that he has to use to do it he's branded as 'evil' to make the townsfolk run the Earth and Water mages out. And my Water mage is dying, and his Apprentice becomes 'Ice' instead of Water because my Water mage is holding onto his last little bit of power.

Thanks for pointing out that Earth gets overlooked - my Earth mage is assigned power to move rock (including lava) around, so she's probably all right.

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[info]chisotahn
2005-09-04 09:08 pm UTC (link)
My five-elemental system is Fire, Earth, Wind, Water and Time. Time is the invisible element that propels all life along. ^^ It's fun to mess with.

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:53 am UTC

[info]kgbooklog
2005-09-04 09:18 pm UTC (link)
Jim Butcher's high fantasy series has an elemental system that does most of what you want. He uses 6 elements (adding Metal and Wood), and the characters use them for boring everyday stuff.

Unfortunately, the plot and characters aren't handled very well at all (especially compared to his Dresden books).

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(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:53 am UTC

[info]cinnamonical
2005-09-04 09:26 pm UTC (link)
Woohoo! Thaaaaaaank you so much! Nothing less than what I expected of you.

I'm amused you touched on the whole fifth element thing--I've been trying (almost to the point of paranoia and neurosis) to work it into a story I'm doing (a fanfiction, actually) without having it be cliche and cheesy. It's based on a theoretical fifth element of spirit/quintessence/aethyr/ether/whatever other name it happens to go by, and I believe Aristotle mentioned it as the stuff of the heavens or something like that. Any thoughts? I have a lot of different ways to go on it, 'cause most of the sources I've read that put it within the context of historical alchemy conflict or aren't clear.

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(no subject) - [info]criada, 2005-09-04 10:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cinnamonical, 2005-09-05 01:58 am UTC

[info]beccastareyes
2005-09-04 09:28 pm UTC (link)
Someone over on (I think) [info]bad_rpers_suck once suggested a few untraditional fire-aspected people after seeing one too many red-headed hot-tempered fire mages/pyrokinetics. Like an old grandmotherly-type whose house always smells of cinnamon and who makes the best cookies ever. Or a blacksmith/other sort of smith who uses his fire magic to craft metal or glass with finer control than his tools would allow (IIRC, there are plenty of things you can do to the fire in a forge to screw things up).

Though it only plays into how they view psychics, I'm thankful the conculture I have has at least a moderatly different view of the element (Still probably too close to the Greek ones) -- they have heat+metal, wind+rain+small sources of water, deep water+space, and rock.

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[info]snapes_angel
2005-09-04 09:29 pm UTC (link)
There are five elements in some philosophies in our world, the fifth being wood. I was looking something else up and happened to see it.

Psrsonally (although I'm working with five right now), I tend to think if we're going to have wood then we might as well include metal. The seventh (or fifth) IMO would be the mind, or the realm of conscious (and perhaps subconscious) thought.

But then, I'm a bit sane. >=}

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[info]wolfychan
2005-09-04 10:28 pm UTC (link)
There's an elemental magic story by Orson Scott Card called "Sandmage," which treats sand as an element all its own, representing the desert and the wasteland. It's an interesting example of how you can add "new" elements without being fluffy or going all Captain Planet.

(I always did feel bad for the "heart" kid on that show. The other ones could summon fireballs and earthquakes and whatnot, and he could... talk to his monkey.)

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(no subject) - [info]pyrasaur, 2005-09-04 10:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:56 am UTC

[info]pyrasaur
2005-09-04 10:53 pm UTC (link)
Hmm, with so many alternatives to consider, it's a shame that stereotypes run so rampant.

I'm writing a system where the basic elements are fire, water, electricity and plant. Earth and air are seen as simply the basic setting of life, like a palette for the other elements to manipulate.
Then there's light and dark magic, sort of the royalty of elements (and, no, dark magic isn't necessarily evil). They can both heal but they strongly oppose each other; casting a light healing spell on a dark magic user could kill them.
Psychic is the black sheep element. You can't learn it unless you have a natural talent for it, and the natural talent is very, very rare and difficult to control.
Then there's pure magic, which has no elemental alignment at all. Because of that, there's nothing to ground it, so pure magic is unpredictable and dangerous. It's exclusive to the gods and one much-feared variety of fish. Eating the flesh of that fish is pretty much a recipe for disaster.

...Yeah, after writing that out, it really seems odd to me that people would use the same old tired conventions. Making crap up is fun!

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(no subject) - [info]ariescelestial, 2005-09-04 11:52 pm UTC

[info]jaquiel
2005-09-04 10:55 pm UTC (link)
I think that in every elemental system, you should try to do something that nobody has ever done before. Especially since elemental magic is used so often.

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(no subject) - [info]rhjunior, 2005-09-04 11:54 pm UTC

[info]rhjunior
2005-09-04 11:48 pm UTC (link)
It seems to ME that the "I am at one with teh natueral Wurld" is the MOST annoying cliche' in fantasy today. Generally because those that exercise it in their writing show absolutely no understanding of the natural world, and get their characters' talking points from Greenpeace or PETA.
I would love to see one "nature mage" who was aware of the natural world as it really is--- not a "harmonious balance" or a beautiful circle of life, but an ongoing, bloody war of attrition, with every mindless, bestial species doing its damnedest to feed, fight and fornicate till it covers the earth and devours everything. Think that's not the case? Take a species out of its typical environment and watch what happens. Without their normal predators or competition, they'll obliterate everything in their path. The cold reality is that humanity is the only species that gives a rat's patoot about "the environment." The average timber wolf would chuck the whole job for a crate of alpo, a can opener and an opposable thumb.

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(no subject) - [info]l_clausewitz, 2005-09-05 12:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rhjunior, 2005-09-06 12:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2005-09-05 01:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rhjunior, 2005-09-06 01:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]baeraad, 2005-09-05 08:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]goldjadeocean, 2005-09-06 04:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]beccastareyes, 2005-09-06 05:01 am UTC

[info]l_clausewitz
2005-09-05 12:06 am UTC (link)
*puts on a stupid face* Has anybody tried to make cannon into an element on their own?

(That's what you get when you connect elemental magic with an artillery maniac.)

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[info]ataniell93
2005-09-05 12:21 am UTC (link)
People who use "spirit" as a fifth element have almost always read Starhawk or other neo-Pagan author.

That'd be fine if they used the ideas that are supposed to go along with it, I reckon, but nobody ever does.

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(no subject) - [info]tamerterra, 2005-09-05 12:55 pm UTC

[info]dwg
2005-09-05 12:44 am UTC (link)
Poor ignored earth mages.

They could be so kick-arse. I mean, golem much? What about the teracotta warriors? Dude, earth mages could be quite formiddable during conflict. Out of conflict? Wouldn't having one around and being nice to them (and provided its their character) maybe they'll help make your lands just a bit richer to produce better crops. The could pull up some of the good, volcanic soil or something. So it's not as flashy as say, throwing fireballs, or lightning bolts, or suffocating the crap out of someone - but it could still be fairly impressive when you're demolishing a city with an earthquake or setting off a tsunami.

I will admit to being guilty about having a couple of people with fire and water - ice, specifically - being enemies, but it's more than just an elemental thing, they just plain hate each other from the bottom of their little hearts. Having more than just "Well, he's a fire/ice elemental and I hate that!" makes for much better reading and animosity. I'm having some fun with a twisted game of one-upmanship between them. I'm certainly not going to be so stupid as to say that everyone with pyrokinesis will hate everyone with cryokinesis, because I can't honestly think of a good reason for it.

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(no subject) - [info]kay_willow, 2005-09-05 04:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dwg, 2005-09-05 06:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tamerterra, 2005-09-05 12:57 pm UTC

[info]___sasuka
2005-09-05 01:00 am UTC (link)
Yes. YES. THANK YOU.

Emotional fire... now that sounds like something that would completely rip up somebody's mind.

I've always loved Earthmages because... they are badass. There is nothing like hurtling a boulder at 894617945987648648742175 mph. And they are going to HURT.

There's always more you could add to the four-elements. Snow and ice, fog/mist/storm/rain, and on. *grin* it's good fun.

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[info]sparrow_wings
2005-09-05 02:05 am UTC (link)
Another thing for fire mages to do: manipulate the length of growing seasons by keeping the temperature at such and such a level (they could co-operate with weather mages). [/random]

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