Game Politics ([info]gamepolitics) wrote,
@ 2005-11-11 08:55:00
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Game-bashing Member of Parliament Calls for Govt. Rating System

In the USA we have Jack Thompson. Our UK gaming brethren have Keith Vaz.

As outlined in an interview with MCV, Labour Party MP Vaz is hoping to enact a game rating system controlled by the British government.

"I want to see a statutory system, not a voluntary code drawn up by the industry itself," Vaz told MCV. "I'm introducing my own Bill to make sure that happens. It's not - and never has been - something that can be done by the industry itself."

Roger Bennet, head of ELSPA, the Euro-equivalent of the ESA, expressed frustration over the idea of government control.

"This proposal is way beyond need," Bennet said. "Our system is tried, tested and trusted. A mandatory scheme would drive a coach and horses through the PEGI rating system which is robust, consistent across much of the Continent and open to consumers. It would fragment the entire procedure, forcing governments to draw up individual guidelines. It would be an absolute disaster for the games industry."

For his part, Vaz does not believe laws already in place to govern video game content are sufficient. Currently, any game content that includes violence and/or sexual activity must be submitted to the British Board of Film Classification (BBFC) for review and rating. Other titles are rated by the pan-European PEGI system.




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Stupid is as stupid does.
[info]yukimurasanada
2005-11-11 02:24 pm UTC (link)
Well, looks like Mr. Vaz has been drinking THompsons Kool aid. His brain has been reduced to a walnut sized clump capable of nothing but selfish self promotion. Just like our buddy JT.

I just hope they have a legal system over there that has something like ours, where a bill like this can be struck down, but I don't know enough about goverment over there to say.

Vaz however, strikes me as being in the same mind as Jack, therefore, I see him meeting the same fate. In the end, his oppenents will cancel him out, he'll be humiliated, and reduced to obscurity.

Jack can't even win a fight with two guys who do a webcomic, and he loses any serious case he gets involved in. I doubt vaz will have better luck.

Still, just more scarmongering by ignorant politicans.

Nothing changes, no matter where you go.

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[info]aniki21
2005-11-11 02:25 pm UTC (link)
I'ma email Mr. Vaz.

If he thinks he'll get this through without a fight, he's got another thing coming.

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[info]dagrak
2005-11-11 03:03 pm UTC (link)
I've emailed him too, to find out what he thinks is wrong with the system and what his new plan entails.

Personally though I don't think he is raging a war on video games, I just think he doesn't quite understand the existing system or that games can be played by adults.

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[info]aniki21
2005-11-11 04:08 pm UTC (link)
I've posted my letter on my journal, if anybody else wants to write and finds themselves at a loss for words.

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[info]repsode
2005-11-11 02:50 pm UTC (link)
God almighty!. Actually I don't see the need for this at all. A lot of publishers are just submitting games to the BBFC anyway, regardless of if they need to or not. The games that need to be controlled in the UK already are.

Jeez what is wrong with him?

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[info]repsode
2005-11-11 02:59 pm UTC (link)
Don't worry, it won't get through. Parliament knows that the system we have now is good enough. Though i have to question the idea of PEGI though. No two countries standards are the same. If the industry all used the BBFC(which as ive sade is a growing trend), then there's no need for this new legisation.

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[info]repsode
2005-11-11 03:04 pm UTC (link)
Oops I meant "If the industry is all using the BBFC"

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Well hes not exactly a model of good behaviour?
(Anonymous)
2005-11-11 03:07 pm UTC (link)
I can't ever remember if he was cleared over fast tracking passports etc to those with enough money who wanted to become British citizens but hes got a colourful past.

I can't see this going far, it is just bandwaggoning on Mr Vaz's part. The BBFC works, a game in this country gets an 18 rating if it needs it and no parent can misunderstand that logo on the box.

If anyone wants to email Mr Vaz *constructive* comments then his email address is: vazk@parliament.uk

Owain.

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Re: Well hes not exactly a model of good behaviour?
[info]repsode
2005-11-11 03:32 pm UTC (link)
Yes, i think I will and I beleive I will direct him to the BBFC website as well. Oh by the way those of you in the US don't know how big the BBFC puts these ratings symbols on game packaging. Find a scan of GTA: LCS from uk to see what I mean, You cant miss it!

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Keith Thompson, er, Vaz.
[info]rich_d7
2005-11-11 03:33 pm UTC (link)
I emailed Vaz myself when he first appeared and got a reply saying he was taking my comments with interest. Obviously my comments were outweighed by the thought of appearing on television and possibly getting some money.

Gaurantee it will be about setting up some new regulation body (we love them in the UK) and he'll end up running it... for a SMALL fee.

Unfortunately as well, we don't have a constitution or bill of rights, so often our government can just change the rules whenever they feel like it. Everything gets voted mind you, but voted by members of the government only.

Rich

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Re: Keith Thompson, er, Vaz.
[info]aniki21
2005-11-11 04:10 pm UTC (link)
Nah, he wants the BBFC to rate them with optional government intervention to ban specific games, if his comments about Bully are anything to go by.

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[info]darguskelen
2005-11-11 03:47 pm UTC (link)
:D

I just thought of something. Is there a government rating system for movies? No. We have the MPAA to do that. And when there were killings based on the Matrix series, did someone call for government control of the rating systems? Or did they even do anything to try and ban violent movies? No. So, following the example of movies, why don't they just leave us gamers alone?

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[info]amisplacedphile
2005-11-11 03:55 pm UTC (link)
Because it's the current hot-button. And teh Game industry isn't screaming PIRACY!!!11!! PIRACY IS WHY OR SALES SUCK OMG!!!

Because the video game industry is not a billion dollar enterprise, throwing millions of dollars at a shitty game in hopes it will get better, they spend less and instead present something that can be enjoyed and sold, or enjoyed over and over again. Unlike movie theatre tickets, where they attack with and accuse you of being a pirate after you paid to get in, and shove commercials down your throat and charge you out the ass for a shitty plot/effects/overpriced bad acting.

I gurantee you if the video game industry mimiced the RIAA/MPAA this wouldn't be an issue, because then they'd be 'victims.'

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[info]amisplacedphile
2005-11-11 03:55 pm UTC (link)
And it'd help if I speel checked before I posted, tew.

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[info]joshdavis271
2005-11-11 03:53 pm UTC (link)
I cannot help but laugh, this guy is too cute, I hate it when people call for government rating system, the voluntary system is doing fine, just because there was one incident does not mean that hot coffee will not happen under the government's nose.

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(Deleted post)

[info]rich_d7
2005-11-11 04:18 pm UTC (link)
Nice letter, I especially like the point of ciggarette companies not being held responsible when an under 16 smokes, so why should video game companies be responsible when an 18 rated game gets into a childs hands.

It's like blaming Ford when a kid steals a car and crashes it into a wall or something.

This really is just about some people trying to make a name for themselves (or in JT's case, sell a book) by attacking an industry that is still very new and therefore still considered limited in it's support - if you get my meaning.

Once again, nice letter. Along with mine and the countless others Mr Vaz may soon receive, we may just make him realise he could end up being the UK's Jack Thompson...!!!!!

Rich

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Smackdown!
[info]rich_d7
2005-11-11 04:20 pm UTC (link)
Just a little side bit here, but just got Smackdown! v Raw 2006 from HMV in the UK and the PEGI label says 16+, yet on the DVD it has the standard BBFC PG logo!

So it looks like even the less violent (yes I know it's all staged - I only watch it for Stacy Keibler) titles are going through the BBFC as well. That sort of pisses on Mr Vaz's campaign a bit.

Rich

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Re: Smackdown!
[info]digitalpr0n
2005-11-11 05:06 pm UTC (link)
As far as I know, although I'm not certain, I believe any game with live action footage HAS to be rated by the BBFC in the same way. The BBFC's probably rating any clips and entrance videos where as PEGI is rating the game content.

That's my best guess anyway.

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Is it just me....
[info]jdmdsp911
2005-11-11 04:38 pm UTC (link)
Every time I see that particular picture of the guy I am reminded of Pinky from Pinky and the Brain. "Hey there Brain. Just call me Mr. Vaz. Narf!!!"

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I hate to say "I told you so"...
[info]illspirit
2005-11-11 04:57 pm UTC (link)
But, yea, didn't I say this dude was Jack Thompson 2 last time he was brought up? Nobody believed me, yet here he is, demanding a mandatory rating system top protect kids from content that already has a mandatory rating system. A system which has the force of law behind the ratings, no less.

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[info]lotharhex
2005-11-11 04:58 pm UTC (link)
There already IS a legal system you great tit (talking to Vaz). It's called the BBFC. It's here, IT WORKS. Any game that has violent or sexual content goes to the BBFC and is rate legally. It's illegal for me to seel an 18 rated game to anyone under 18, if I do, I go to prison and get a 3-5 grand fine. What else do you want? My hands to be cut off?

Bloody tit.

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A Question
[info]catch_33
2005-11-11 05:05 pm UTC (link)
What exactly is this guy's reasoning for fucking with a system that apparently works?

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My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
[info]digitalpr0n
2005-11-11 05:05 pm UTC (link)
Just sent this to him. I think it describes how we all feel.

Dear Mr. Vaz,

The very first thing I would like to say before you hit the delete key is that it is not my intention to send you any kind of nasty, hate-fuelled comments. As a proud countryman of the UK I've always been taught to debate things reasonably and rationally and that will never change. I'm sure you've probably received a lot of angry e-mails over your decision to put a bill for video game regulation in - but there are those of us who won't resort to that kind of campaign.

As a long-time gamer, I am somewhat confused at your proposal for video game regulation. I certainly do agree that certain games need to stay out of the hands of kids - if I had a child, peer pressure or no peer pressure, I certainly wouldn't let him/her play a Grand Theft Auto or a Manhunt whilst they were legally my responsbility. However, the system we have now (as I understand it) is that games with violent or sexual content *MUST* be submitted to the BBFC in the same way a film production would be. These are legally binding ratings that retailers and consumers must adhere to - I have indeed seen many a youngster denied service as they could not produce the neccessary ID to buy a GTA game.

I would like to know what you are trying to achieve with your bill. The biggest problem is a lack of understanding; retailers are powerless to refuse a mother from buying the game for her son, and believe me, they do. Shortly after the release of Resident Evil 4 on the Gamecube earlier this year, I overheard a conversation where a member of the sales staff at a major High Street store tried to explain the violent and bloody content in the game. The mother's reply was a very simple "Oh well, they see it all on TV anyway". The boy couldn't have been older than 7 or 8. Let me be the first to assure you that although we may have different perspectives on video games, I cannot condone that kind of response and was quite horrified by the comment. Even with the greatest will in the world, a new standard mandatory rating system is not going to stop this practice, and if anything, will further confuse potential games buyers - everyone can recognise the BBFC's 18 sticker, it's been a staple in films for many, many years. Would they recognise a different system to such an extent?

I feel that it would be much more beneficial for the government and gamers to work together to end what I see as a breakdown in communication. We have been getting a very bad rep worldwide at the moment because - as with anything - the minority are spoiling it for the majority. We have to educate parents on the matters of why games are classified the way they are, whilst promoting the educational potential of games to youngsters. The BBC already see gaming as a big market, as they have released interactive software based on CBeebies properties such as the Tellytubbies. It's also well-known that action games improve hand-eye co-ordination which can lead to superior performance in outdoor activities.

Please, as a heartfelt plea from a gamer, look at this rationally from all angles and do not shut us out - let us help. You'll find that the vast majority are behind you in the theory of regulation; all we have ever wanted is to be able to enjoy a well produced video game, in the same way that others enjoy films, books and works of art, without being branded as "wasters", "losers" or "pixelantes".

Thanks for your time,
Rob Bowker.
Staff Writer :: NTSC-UK.com

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Re: My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
(Anonymous)
2005-11-12 06:24 pm UTC (link)
You didn't get any response to this yet, and I think that's terrible. Nice letter. Extremely nice letter, and one which might well strike a chord with anyone more reasonable than Jack Thompson.

As a UK gamer, I'm elated that there are those of us capable of such restraint and eagerness to help the cause.

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Re: My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
[info]digitalpr0n
2005-11-14 10:22 am UTC (link)
Hah, he replied this morning...

"Thank you for your email to Mr. Vaz.

Mr Vaz is campaigning for the Games Industry to be monitored closely and
believes that the game "Bully" in particular needs to be debated,
especially as it is touches on a larger issue.

Thank you for taking the trouble to write."

Canned response!

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Re: My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
[info]aniki21
2005-11-14 10:50 am UTC (link)
That is exactly the same response I got.

Bastards. I've half a mind to write back and complain - this guy is trying to make a decision that is very likely to affect my entertainment choice, and his staff won't even bother to read my letter closely enough to notice anything I said?

I want them to address my concerns and convince me that Mr. Vaz isn't a lunatic on a moralistic crusade for censorship like Jack is, Goddammit.

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Re: My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
[info]dagrak
2005-11-14 01:10 pm UTC (link)
Having done a bit of research on Mr Vaz, I think perhaps we can consider him a rather untrustworthy MP

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/1809146.stm

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Re: My honest letter to Mr. Vaz
[info]dagrak
2005-11-14 11:24 am UTC (link)
Heh! I got exactly the same response too!

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[info]rich_d7
2005-11-11 05:10 pm UTC (link)
The reply I got from him didn't give me any impression that he would respond ala Jack Thompson. Although his views may be in the similar vein, I think he's someone who would be willing to debate without resorting to the tactics used by that failed lawyer.

Let us know if you get a reply.

Rich

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[info]godofyouall
2005-11-11 05:49 pm UTC (link)
As per the MCV story:

>>>The Video Standards Council is similarly concerned. “Vaz doesn’t want to know about the facts,” VSC director Laurie Hall said. “ELSPA and ourselves have tried to explain this to Mr Vaz and he doesn’t want to listen. We have consulted senior lawyers and the government and they were both perfectly happy. What more needs to be done?”

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A very good link
[info]godofyouall
2005-11-11 05:44 pm UTC (link)
A very good link if anyone is interested.

go to the "video violence section" it is relevant to video games also.

http://www.videostandards.org.uk/main.html

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[info]oncebluemoon
2005-11-11 06:02 pm UTC (link)
There must be a better picture of that man. I can't take him seriously when he looks like the hamburgler. Though perhaps that's the point.

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[info]catch_33
2005-11-11 06:09 pm UTC (link)
How's this:

Image Hosted by ImageShack.us

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[info]oncebluemoon
2005-11-11 06:15 pm UTC (link)
Maybe some people are inherently silly-looking. He looks slightly more evil to me in that picture. Though the lighting is probably why. That or Dick Cheney's lovechild with Ms. Rice.

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If it ain't broke...
[info]evilrockstu
2005-11-11 06:17 pm UTC (link)
What a spectacular waste of time and money, I'm glad I don't live in Britain to pay taxes to chumps like this anymore. :-/

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[info]mharpold8
2005-11-11 08:23 pm UTC (link)
Why don't our lobbyists have cool lines like "A mandatory scheme would drive a coach and horses through the PEGI rating system"?

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(Anonymous)
2005-11-11 10:08 pm UTC (link)
I just have to say that this guys picture is hilarious!

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[info]theparable
2005-11-11 10:13 pm UTC (link)
He looks like he's made from slightly cooked happy marshmallows

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I'm a crusader blah blah blah
(Anonymous)
2005-11-11 11:19 pm UTC (link)
That brown Stay Puft Marshmallow man of a politician probably couldn't get an affair the way he looks, so of COURSE he would be an ass about maturer rated videogames.

He's the type of person I'd obliterate in a bar fight that's for sure.

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Yikes!
[info]viridiscervus
2005-11-12 03:36 am UTC (link)
Who hit him with a shovel?

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[info]arashi_soul
2005-11-12 11:16 am UTC (link)
Yeah, the picture says it all, really. XD

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Someone had better send over a campain contibution, quick!
(Anonymous)
2005-11-12 03:41 pm UTC (link)
You want to parliament puke to get off his soap box, write him a cheque for his re-election bid. It works wonders here in Canada. It's actually scary how well that works.

I imagine it's the same in the UK and everywhere else. The one thing that a politician craves is votes but they really don't care how they get them. They do know that it takes a lot of money to run an effective campain...

Pass him some cash, he'll play ball.

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